2.5" tall Doucai cups. Are these authentic Ming ?

From a recent auction. How does one tell if they are that old?

 

Dunno 'bout that, but I like 'em...a lot!
The signatures are individual; I'll assume the clay color is a valid clue.

 

Nadeau auction house in Windsor, CT? I was just there about a week ago. Love them.

 

They are very pretty, but the colours are too delicate, not the strong, more saturated Ming colours, like on this one from the British Museum:
https://www.britishmuseum.org/collection/object/A_PDF-A-779

Another clue is that there are thought to be only two of these grape stemcups in existence. One is the British Museum cup, the other was sold last year through Sotheby's Hongkong:
https://www.sothebys.com/en/buy/auc...extremely-rare-doucai-grapevine-stem-cup-ming
To find two other Chenghua grape stemcups would be a miracle.
Also, the marks on Ming porcelain tend to have a bolder look.

A more general note on marking:
On both Ming and Qing marks there is a thickening of the paint where a character ends, usually also a thickening of the line. You can see that the maker rested the brush for a split second before lifting it from the surface.

 

Hello ANy: thanks for your comments.

Well this is where it got confusing for me. I did see the Hong Kong one that you mention but there are also a few more that seem to be similar:

https://tw.bid.yahoo.com/item/101733326380

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/chinese-doucai-porcelain-wine-cup-1859549017

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/pair-chinese-doucai-porcelain-stem-1820110614

https://digitalarchive.npm.gov.tw/Collection/Detail/2221?dep=U

I supposed they are apocryphal except for the one at the museum but how do you differentiate them?

 

The Ming ones have those strong, saturated colours I mentioned above. Some of the ones in the links look anaemic compared to the Chenghua examples.
The museum one could be later as well, it looks it to me, but I leave that for museum experts to squabble over.

 

Oh thanks that helps. But also you mentioned the glaze on the outer edge of the base when we were discussing these last week. Which I think these other apocryphal copies seem to meet that requirement. Or do you not think so.

 

Some of them have footrim glazes that continue all the way to the bottom, Ming style, but not the Ming painting technique, which makes me unsure about their age. But as always it is best to have them in hand, which unfortunately we are not in the opportunity to do.

 

But I was asking if the other ones I linked to have the foot rim thing that you mentioned going on? I'm trying to sharpen my skills with these not ready to buy stuff