Featured 5x 19th Century Needlepoints & Tapestries Help

Recently, I purchased a lot of 3 hand-woven ?19th century? tapestries and 2 hand-stitched 19th century needlepoints from the UK. Honestly, I'm a bit out of my element here. Some of the subject matter is also atypical for me. I had a hunch these were authentic though and just couldn't resist making the purchase!

I performed a bit of detective work on the frames but don't have nearly the textile expertise to dig deeper. Do you have thoughts on age, subject matter, weaver, etc.? The needlepoints are in newish, low quality laminate frames w/o archival mounting materials. Is it worth reglazing all works with museum glass? Are these unusual/interesting pieces? All opinions/thoughts/criticism welcome!

Needlepoint #1, Women Feeding Swans in Public Garden (17"x25" sight). Probably reframed post WW2:



Verso:



Needlepoint #2, Woman Dancing with Tambourine (17-1/2" x 22" sight). Stretcher bars appear to have rectangular shank "Type A" cut nails circa 1800-1830:



Verso:



Tapestry #1, Farmer with Goat in Country (18"x18" sight). Framed with antique machine cut "L head" finish nails (perhaps "T head"):



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Tapestries 2 and 3, Aristocrats in the Country (11"x11" sight each). Also framed with antique "L Head" finish nails:



Verso:



Thank you in advance!

 

Lovely needlework!
Just wondering why you call three of them tapestries? They all look like needlepoint to me. Needlepoint is stitched on a canvas mesh, true tapestry is woven on a loom.
Also, what indicates to you that they could be 19th century?
Just trying to educate myself.

 

Agree. They all do appear to be needlepoint, much of which was produced from pre-printed canvases. (That's helpful to know because sometimes one can find duplicates.)

Debora

 

Thank you! I called them tapestries because I'm outside my comfort zone. I didn't notice the canvas threads on the last 3. All of the canvas thread I can see appears to be unprinted.

For age, I examined the nails in the frames/stretchers. I'm quite unfamiliar with the portrayed scenes however so unfortunately, I can't conclude much from the content. Do you have any thoughts there?

I noticed the tambourine dancer canvas had detached from a couple of the nails in its stretchers. Then, I removed one of those nail heads and examined the underside. The nail appears to be a "Type A" machine cut nail circa 1800-~1830 given the shape of the shank. The stretchers are also very dark and appear quite old. Key to Age of Antique Metal Nails Context, Head, Shank, Details Help ID Age a Nail (inspectapedia.com)

Please see pictures:





The frames on the 3 "non-tapestries" are secured with machine cut finish nails. The nails appear to be driven at a slight angle and rust staining appears to be heavier on one side. I theorized they could be "L head" nails, which are potentially closer to 1800 than 1890. Alternatively, they would be more typical machine cut finish nails. Regardless, I'm quite confident these are pre-1890. Perhaps as early as 1800.





I'm having more trouble dating the "Swan Ladies" though. 19th century women's fashion is overwhelming. What are your thoughts on the latest possible age of the dresses they are wearing? Might be possible to establish the "early" end of a date range.

Thank you again

 

I'd think the late Georgian period (1800-1830) would be quite early for any of those, including the "tambourine dancer" who I suspect is meant to be Italian with Naples behind her. The women with swans are wearing Baroque (17th century) dress not Victorian. The needlepoint appears to be much later.

As you just bought these, what were you told about them by the seller?

Debora

 

Appreciate all of your help.

I purchased the set from a major auction house in the UK. The focus of this sale was interior decorations, with many from the 19th century. There was no age given for the needlework, however the valuation was 200-400 GBP plus buyer's premium and there was competition. They keep a fairly high bar for entries.

What do you look for in needlepoints to differentiate late Georgian and Victorian pieces? I've been surprised by the good condition of many older pieces from UK auction houses. Unless the nails were new old stock, unusual for the period, or I'm missing something I don't know how the dancer would date later than around 1835. I apologize if I'm coming across as rude- just don't have much experience with older needlepoint.

Is there something about the style of these needlework patterns that appears newer? Thank you for your patience with my questions.

I will also reach out to the auction house with questions, however in many cases information available is limited.

 

Well, why don't you do an Google Image search for Georgian needlepoint and see if you find anything that looks similar?

Debora

 

To be honest, most of the needlepoints (all ages) I've found on Google are floral scenes, etc. Many are silkworks, not made entirely from wool. Surely much also depends on the skill of the weaver?

This is much smaller and appears more faded:

Antique Needlework C1800 in Original Wood Stretcher and Frame - Etsy

1841:

Early 19th Century English Tapestry/needlework/embroidery on - Etsy

Claims late 18th century:

A Charming Late 18th Century English Antique Framed & Glazed - Etsy

This is a silkwork, however it still has good dimensionality, shading, etc.:

Early 19th Century English Georgian Silk Needlework Painting, Framed | Chairish

P.S. Floral but claims to be c 1820: GEORGIAN Rosewood Fire Screen 1820 - 51" x 32" Original Needlepoint Superb! | eBay

c 1830's on Ebay: 1830's Georgian Period English Needlepoint Wall Art Original Frame | eBay

 

Needlewoman, not weaver. And I'm not sure how reliable those date attributions of the linked works would be.

Debora

 

Or perhaps needlemen?

According to the Smithsonian, professional embroidery was fairly common back in the early 19th century. Edit: Whoops, I meant to reference the Met: American Needlework in the Eighteenth Century | Essay | The Metropolitan Museum of Art | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History (metmuseum.org)

These needlepoints are apparently quite fine at about 18 stitches per inch and about 40 stitches per inch for the petit point areas. A range of colors were used, especially in the swan picture. Perhaps these were stitched by professionals?

According to my research, antique samplers commonly seen on the market were completed by younger girls with less experience and probably less skill than professionals.

Are there particular aspects of the scenes that appear newer? I'm just trying to get a general handle on rarity to determine how to address storage and conservation. If it's worthwhile, I'd like to reframe one or two with museum glass for display. If they are all just 20th century throw-backs, I might resell or store some in the closet.

Thank you again and appreciate your patience! While I've spent hours this week researching needlepoint history, my experience here is very limited.

 

According to my research, antique samplers commonly seen on the market were completed by younger girls with less experience and probably less skill.

according to others.... their skill level was unrivalled ........

 

Those are fantastic! Not trying to detract but,

"After a young lady learned to embroider a sampler, she might attend a female academy to make a silk embroidered picture. This was a more challenging technique that became popular in the early 1800s. Subjects included classical, biblical, and historical scenes, as well as mourning pictures."

Margaret McKay | National Museum of American History (si.edu)

The Met link above mentions professional embroidery...

P.S.

Jane Allgood - English embroidery - Wikipedia



Wikipedia: "In the Georgian era, canvaswork was popular for chair coverings, footstools, screens and card tables. Embroidered pictures and upholstery both reflected the popular pastoral theme of men and women in the sheep-cropped English countryside."

English embroidery - Wikipedia

 

Those headless tack nails are still used by framers. The colours look too bright to be early: aniline. I agree with Deborah that most of these were pre prints. And yes, needlepoint. None of the imagery looks early 19th to me or even 19th.

 

Agree. To my eye, first 3rd-ish of 20th century.

Debora

 

My impression, too, was early 20th century... hence my initial questioning.
Glad I'm not the only one!

 

I think the swan feeders are the latest, they might even be post WW2. The rest, 30s ish.

Might be worth a thread burn test too.