Antique brass mortar and pestle

Hi all,from what I read on a previous thread and the very insightful and knowledgeable comments made by Shangas,convinced me that this must be a proper antique one. The use and age looks genuine and the shape of the rim
is also not perfect (a good sign) There’s a square little looks like infill where the pinhole or little dip should be? Together it weighs about 2,5kg. The mortar stands 11cm tall and the pestle is 19cm long.Do you agree regarding the age? From somewhere around the 2nd part of the 19th century? Thank you for any comments

 

@Shangas
Can you please tell me what you think. Thanks

 

Nice find, Boland. Looks good, a proper antique imo.
Shangas can tell you all about it.

 

Hi AJ,that’s good news. Thank you so much for the reply

 

Definitely looks like it has some solid age to it. There ARE modern brass ones too, of course, but they look far too "clean". PERFECT smooth surfaces, CRISP cut lines and decorations, FLAWLESS engravings.

This is NOT perfect, crisp, and flawless (no offense), because this would likely have been hand-spun on a lathe. Would've started out as a blank, brass cylinder, and someone went in with a chisel and carved away at it.

I don't see any real evidence that it's been cast (except maybe the handles, which makes sense). The roughness, especially on the base, indicates the age and use.

Gotta remember that when these were made, they were NOT meant to be cutesy little dust-collectors - they were used rough and put away wet, every single day - plus, it's a mortar and pestle - it's designed to be bashed around - literally. So the imperfections indicate its age, its genuine use, and this isn't really stuff that you can fake - I mean, you can TRY, but it's never very convincing. Old dents and scruffs vs new dents and scruffs look very different.

For example, you can see the dark lines and patches where it's been chipped or scratched, and then the brass tarnished inside the scratches, but it's shinier outside - because when you polish it, you can't get into the cracks/scratch-marks, so they get darker and darker while the surface that you can reach, stays shiny.

As for the square "patch" on the base - I admit that one is new to me. I've bought and sold and collected loads of these things. I've seen cast ones, but most of the ones I've seen are lathe-spun, and I've never come across one with a patch on the base. Most seem not to have been bothered by the mandrill-mark on the base, and never bothered trying to hide it.

I mean - it's underneath, you're never going to see it, so why bother hiding it?

My guess - and this is only a guess - is that the mandrill left such a gouge in the brass that it weakened the base, so they cut it out and poured in more brass to plug it and reinforce it.

 

Shangas,many thanks for interesting and informative reply and for sharing your knowledge. Glad you agree that it has true age. What you say about the ‘plug’ makes perfect sense (I didn’t really know what to make of it)

 

As far as I know, there is no scholarly, written history on mortars and pestles - at least, not of the brass variety as shown here.

A lot of what I say is based on collecting experience, or educated conjecture, based on deductive reasoning & observation, a'la Sherlock Holmes.

What makes sense, given what we see, and what does not? What's the most likely scenario or theory?

People look at stuff like this through a modern viewpoint - ie - it's an antique, it has to be valuable, and treated with care, and delicacy, etc.

But that's not what it is. It's not some fancy-schmancy antique. It's an everyday object, and they were treated as everybody treats everyday objects - without much thought. So you gotta decide if the item shows evidence of such treatment. That's what tells you whether it's REALLY an antique, or some modern reproduction.

Just as an example - here's a brass M&P from AMAZON:



Even if I didn't tell you it was new, you could probably tell at once, that it is.

It's very clean and crisp, straight, sharp, angular lines. Looks machine-spun, not done by hand with a chisel on a foot-lathe. Everything is very uniform.

Antique mortars and pestles weren't made like this, simply because the technology did not exist, which means that their cuts and engravings and lines are not this uniform or sharp.

You can see how precise everything is - the rim on the edge is a PERFECT 90-degree right-angle, for example. Even the angle between the base of the mortar and the underside is a perfect 90-degree right-angle. Again - not something you would likely see on an antique one.

 

There are a few Dutch books on mortars and pestles. Since we have a lot of brass ones here, the books probably include brass ones.

Boland, you'll be able to read these listings (and the books), these are currently available:
https://www.marktplaats.nl/v/antiek...en-brons/m2232824909-boek-nederlandse-vijzels

By the same writer:
https://www.boekwinkeltjes.nl/b/212231102/collectie-Unieke-Vijzels/

German site, Dutch book:
https://www.buchfreund.de/de/d/p/76539802/vijzelboek-liefte-verwindt-al-dinck-antieke

Come to think of it, your mortar and pestle could be Dutch, given the history of SA.

 

The first one is also on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Nederlandse-Vijzels-D-Wittop-Koning/dp/B005UJF420

 

Hi AJ,thank you for the links and book suggestion. Yes,it would be interesting to learn more. Also,I agree with you,there’s certainly a strong possibility that it could be Dutch (I didn’t think of the that before)