Featured serene japanese lady

dear all

found these today, didn't have time to clean them up so they are very dirty.
the first set, i am pretty sure it is a "serene" japanese lady lithophane but i have no idea who made it help?




second set, far less exciting with a very poor quality common japanese lady lithophane. 1950s and later. from what i have read, the top H is suppose to indicate Hayasi and HP is for handprinted. gotheborg Hayasi mark has the full name printed, so who actually made this and is this really Hayasi?

 

Heehehe!!...why Geisha...& not just pretty Japanese woman?
I don't see enough hair adornments ....& neither does my friend here !!!

 

You missed the flowers in the first pic?

They are Geishas

 

These are not geishas. Geisha kimonos have a low, plunging neckline.
That porcelain is generally called Geisha girl. Phaik's name serene Geisha is nicer, but the girls are not Geisha's.
It is part of the Geisha-fication of Japanese women, with even the Japanese porcelain industry feeding into the demeaning attitude many foreigners had towards Japanese women.

 

AJ,

You have better eyes than me if you can see the absense of a plunging neckline on the second image. (Or any neckline)

 

No....I said I don't see enough.....

 

Komo,

Your pic, she doesnt have a plunging neckline

 

most that i see don't....but they all have a V neck...some lower......but most have big time hair arrangements..

 

then again...plunging neck line.....no flowers.....
go figger !

 

All the ladies in the photos have plunging necklines. You can tell because the sides of the neck are exposed.
In a regular kimono the neckline looks like a rather high collar, even if you only see the front or side:

That is also what you see on the factory girls who posed for the 'geisha girl' pictures.

This is the Geisha kimono neckline, even if you can't see the back, you can see that the collar doesn't cover the sides of the neck:

A Geisha is a traditional Japanese profession for women, not always voluntary. A geisha girl was a girl who was sold to American GIs for sex. Here is more explanation:
https://www.antiquers.com/threads/a...ify-these-chinese-ceramics.18235/#post-248940

 

@Phaik Hooi , I am not having a go at you, I know you are just trying to find information on your mother's things.

This is part of an ongoing thing on this forum about the awareness of sexual exploitation of Japanese women and under-age girls. This is still a problem on the Japanese island of Okinawa, even resulting in rape at times. Hopefully education on what is what, and who is who, will lead to respect for these women and children. I know this forum is not a soap box, but we should be careful about certain terms and concepts.

 

@Any Jewelry i have changed the title and made amendments to the text. i understand your concern re: terms and concepts.

for me, the word "geisha" is never used in a disrespectful way. my explanation: a long time ago, my mum and i had our past lives "reveal" to us (everything with a pinch of salt). mum was told that she was a geisha in one of her past lives. after all, the meaning of geisha = gei, art (of dancing, singing) + sha, person.

but i agree that "geisha girl" in the american GIs context is a corruption and highly improper. the history of man is full of things that get corrupted along the way, so i thank you for pointing out the collar detail.

 

I fully understand what you are trying to say. But we are not labeling these today.
The term was given way back before political correctness.

If you are looking for information on these lithopanes, you will only find it by using the term that has applied to this item for all these years. Unfortunately, the term is Geisha Girl Lithopane. Whether they actually are or are not geishas does not apply.

Rewriting history and renaming things to fit today's moral standards has gotten way out of hand.
My opinion only, I do not want this to turn into a moral discussion of what is right and wrong.

 

thank you.

 

Ahhh, but you've weighed in now....haven't you ?

& as for today's moral standards....as far as I can see....there are precious few left !

 

dear all
still hoping someone would tell me when and who made the serene lady tea set. i am excited about it because it is a good quality lithophane. so good that you can actually see the image (photo #4 showing top view of tea set) even without the back lighting!
regards
phaik hooi

 

Agree!
I don't think we have to perpetuate the fashion of calling a woman a prostitute (Geisha girl) just because she is Japanese. That has nothing to do with political correctness. If someone calls me a prostitute, I have the right to feel offended, so do Japanese women. It is below the moral standards of any time, probably even more so in the past. Here in the Netherlands I could even take the offender to court if I so wished.

I think Phaik has solved the issue elegantly. And why not call them Japanese lady or girl lithophanes?
I read somewhere the models were young factory girls, but maybe that is not considered an elegant term. No offense meant to young factory girls of course.

 

The true Geishas were/are very accomplished in the arts, and could converse on just about any topic. They received a very long training, often from childhood.

 

I learned that in the controversial book Memoirs of a Geisha. According to the book not everyone could be a Geisha. Beauty and brains were/are a requisite.