What was this used for ?

Discussion in 'Pottery, Glass, and Porcelain' started by Walter901, Jun 17, 2018.

  1. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Very peculiar lid I may say... I have no clue... Anybody got any ideas ?

    Cheers,

    Walter Screenshot_20180617-230337.png Screenshot_20180617-230341.png
     
    Any Jewelry likes this.
  2. johnnycb09

    johnnycb09 Well-Known Member

    I dont know why,but string holder popped into my head.
     
  3. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    It's quite good size like flower pot and heavy. Teak wood. Looks like bird decorated on right. Maybe Japanese or Chinese? I was thinking something to divide a liquid. Top floats out. But no idea what.
     
    judy likes this.
  4. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Walter, do you only want to know what it was used for, or would you like to know where it is from.;)
    I love it, but how big is it?
     
    judy likes this.
  5. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Hi AJ,

    I am waiting for the owner to give me measurements. I would like to know as much as possible about it. I did some research myself and it seems that the star on it and the bird (hoopoe) refer to the Islam. I was thinking it's an old jar to seperate butter from the milk... something like this ?

    P.S. If you are from Hinderloopen, I am from Leeuwarden originally
     
    judy likes this.
  6. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Also, the way it has been painted, most of it with triangles must be typical for some region... i'm sure i've seen it somewhere... but can't place it.
     
    judy likes this.
  7. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Wonderful, a beautiful town. My family has a connection with Leeuwarden, there were some officers who fought in the Frisian army of Burmania against the house of Orange, way back when.
    I am not from Hindeloopen, but from the deep south of the Netherlands, Brabant. I visited Hindeloopen and the famous 11 towns quite often, though. Where do you live now?

    I think you're right, the jar is from an Islamic region. Hard to tell which, right now.
    Is the bird a hoopoe? I would have thought a peacock, which is quite common in Persian and Indo-Persian imagery. Also in other parts of the Islamic world.
    The triangles look inlaid to me. Bone, mother of pearl maybe? Triangular inlay can be found in many parts of Asia and (North) Africa.
    It would be nice if the owner had some more pictures of the sides.
    A lid with a hole certainly suggests churning, or maybe something with oil.
    If we can see more pictures of the decorations, hopefully we can narrow it down to a region, which could bring us closer to the purpose.
     
    judy likes this.
  8. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Ok, as soon as I have new pictures (today) I will post them. if the triangles are inlaid that makes it a nicer object to me (let's hope so). I moved about 15 years ago to Spain, i'm between Valencia and Alicante.
     
    judy likes this.
  9. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    A beautiful part of the world, another one I know reasonably well. We used to stay with friends in Javea/Xabia.
     
    judy likes this.
  10. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Well that's where I live... Javea/Xabia... ! I rent out villas so if you ever want to come around, you know how to find me :)
     
    judy and Any Jewelry like this.
  11. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    Ok I got more pictures. It's def. very solid built. The owner says it's about 20kg. And size is about 48cm tall, 46-47cm diameter. Looking at the pictures myself it was used to press something if you see the inside... IMG-20180618-WA0002.jpg IMG-20180618-WA0008.jpg IMG-20180618-WA0006.jpg IMG-20180618-WA0007.jpg
     
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  12. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    I certainly will, although due to my health I have been an armchair traveler over the last years. But you never know.

    A hefty pot. Yes, it is inlaid, as far as I can see bone inlay. The bird is a peacock, the star is a flower. The style is Indian-Pakistani. You could say a bit of Indo-Persian influence, although the shape and designs are purely local.
    I'd say probably Northwestern India or neighbouring regions of Pakistan.
    Here is something on wood inlay from Hoshiarpur, Punjab, more fanciful, but you get an idea:
    https://theculturetrip.com/asia/india/articles/stunning-wood-art-from-hoshiarpur-in-punjab/
    There is mention of farmers starting this work 300 yrs ago, which is interesting when you think of the utilitarian purpose of the pot. It is not that old though, but it does have age.
     
    judy likes this.
  13. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    The fatty cream will separate itself from the milk as it sits, but it's this component that ends up on top, not the more liquid 'skimmed' milk. If the purpose is to get cream, this would not serve well. Maybe it sat in a bowl when in use, otherwise what was separated out would just be lost & I can't see this still nutritious liquid (if it is milky) being wasted.

    To get butter, you have to take the cream & agitate it in some way, by churning, shaking, etc., so all the tiny bits of fat will collide with & stick to others and make a mass.

    The design does not strike me as good for churning. A possibility I do see is as a press to get the last of the buttermilk out of the butter. This can be done by 'paddling' it by hand, but can image that if you had a large quantity, putting it in a container & applying pressure would be a good way to go. You would still want to catch the buttermilk.

    The square hole puzzles me. More difficult to make than a round one, only needed if whatever went through it had to stay in a particular orientation, wouldn't work properly if it could rotate. Why would a round vessel need a square hole on top?

    The unfinished look of the channels also gets my attention. If they are there for the runoff of a liquid, think you would want to smooth them. And if you're going to make the thing decorative as well as useful, why leave any surface rough? Was there another piece that slotted into those grooves?
     
  14. rhiwfield

    rhiwfield Well-Known Member

    I may be totally wrong, but could the centre hole and three channels indicate a missing handle? There is an absence of ornamentation to these at odds with the rest of the jar

    Edit: Bronwen, just beat me to it ;)
     
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  15. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    I found this indian sprout cooking pot... it also runs off the liquid... s-l500.jpg
     
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  16. i need help

    i need help Moderator Moderator

    DCD317A8-3F7F-44C1-9A21-1EDF38EAD540.jpeg Observation,
    In addition to channels on top, wear and slot, indicate possible handle here. But without lid secured to base, would only be a strap for the lid.
     
    Bronwen likes this.
  17. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    I don't know what it is, legs too short for a peacock. Beak too short & thick for a peacock or a hoopoe; what I can see of it looks more like the parrot family.

    Interesting that the design is done all with little incised triangles & parallelograms.
     
  18. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    But the spout lets you pour it off in a controlled way. The runoff would not just flood out in several directions.

    Does the opening INH has spotted go all the way through? Are there others like it?
     
    i need help likes this.
  19. Walter901

    Walter901 Member

    This is the only one the buyer has. I asked if the bottom comes out he said no.
     
  20. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    It looks like an Indian/Pakistani folk art rendition of a peacock, those are rarely true to life. Like this one, it can never stand on those legs and the neck can't support its head. As for the tail....:playful::
    [​IMG]
     
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