Chinese Bronze Cup? Small w Dragon

Discussion in 'Metalware' started by leeddie, Feb 19, 2017.

  1. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    Have had this little bronze drinking cup/vessel for a few months. I am guessing it was made to drink from. It is small so not sure what else.
    Would it have been part of a set? Age?
    There are still traces of the interior having a gold wash. As can be seen in the pics, it is not perfect. I still find it a cool little piece though.
    Measures 3 7/16"h x 2 1/4" top x 1 5/8" base. Has good weight for size. Nice overall patina.
    Any info would be appreciated. Thanks.
    Eddie

    dragon001.jpg dragon002.jpg dragon003.jpg dragon004.jpg dragon005.jpg dragon006.jpg dragon007.jpg dragon008.jpg
     
  2. Hollyblue

    Hollyblue Well-Known Member

    It doesn't look like bronze,white metal with some type of coating.
     
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  3. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    Thank you. I was wondering why the piece was missing little sections near the top. I found it odd.
     
  4. moreotherstuff

    moreotherstuff Izorizent

    It's a nice looking dragon. My guess is Japanese.
     
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  5. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    I remember reading something about the claws differentiating if Chinese or Japanese. I never thought Japanese. Will have to look up the claw thing again and see .. thanks a lot..
     
  6. Rayo56

    Rayo56 Well-Known Member

    Yeah - just bronze plating - I'd be scared to drink out of that! :hungover:
     
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  7. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    I found the following 2 pieces of info. One is from Wikipedia and the other from Dagonsinn the History of Japanese Dragons...

    "In Japan," writes Gould (1896:248), "it is invariably figured as possessing three claws, whereas in China it has four or five, according as it is an ordinary or an Imperial emblem." During World War II, the Japanese military named many armaments after Chinese dragons.
    Japanese dragon - Wikipedia

    Japanese dragons are similar to those of China, but are more serpentine in shape, have only three claws on each foot, and fly less frequently. The reason why they have three toes/claws is because the Japanese believe Eastern dragons originated in their native homeland. Their belief was that when the dragons began to leave Japan, they gained toes. The further the dragons went, the more toes they gained. Which explains why the Chinese and Korean dragons have more toes.

    Which makes you completely correct. Bingo.. Japanese and not Chinese... cool beans... thanks.

    Eddie
     
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  8. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    lol No drinking out of it. I just enjoy looking at it so I keep it on my desk.
     
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  9. khl889

    khl889 Well-Known Member

    Search "Chinese Copper Dragon Cup" on Google Images and there it is.

    (The counting-the-claws approach was pretty well debunked years ago by a poster on the Ebay board.)
     
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  10. moreotherstuff

    moreotherstuff Izorizent

    It is the treatment of the water, as much as the dragon, that makes me think Japanese.

    There is a hierarchy among oriental dragons as defined by the number of toes, but the only bit I can remember is that the five-toed dragon was limited to Chinese Imperial use (back when such things could be enforced).
     
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  11. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the info. I had not read the debunking of the counting claws. One would of hoped that wiki and the other site which deals in such things as the dragons would have been up to date. Thanks again for the info. I will have to do more research and read the ebay piece.
     
  12. leeddie

    leeddie Well-Known Member

    I found it. The one pictured is the same design just patina is not as dark or even. Thanks again.
     
  13. nokita

    nokita New Member

    It is likely a Japanese ware or the Ryujin drinking cup with 3 clawed water dragon. Likely it is used for ricewine (sake) or herbal kame drinks or sometimes used for brewed medicine mixed from charred plants/exotic animal parts. Multiple use and time may have eroded the lip and the bottom edge of the cup oxidised from heated plate brewing the ale.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2017
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