Dating an item by the 'Made In...' stamp ?

Discussion in 'Antique Discussion' started by bosko69, Mar 4, 2023.

  1. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    I've got a statue of The St. Marco of Venice winged lion (bronze I think & obviously a souvenir),I'm trying to date it.The base is stamped 'Made In Italy' in an oval.
    I've found two different opinions as to when these 'Country of Origin' marks first appeared.
    1."The first significant U.S. law that required products to be marked with their country of origin was the Tariff Act of 1890, also known as the McKinley Tariff (parts of which are still in effect), according to VanGrasstek."
    2.Now here's a quote from the Customs Dept.-"In the United States, the marking statute, Section 304, Tariff Act of 1930, as amended (19 U.S.C. 1304) requires that, unless excepted, every article of foreign origin (or its container) imported into the U.S. shall be marked with its country of origin."
    I remember this being discussed amongst Dealers many times-but dang if a date stuck in my noggin.
    Any opinions ?
    PS-Sorry for such a basic question,but didn't want to keep 'surfing' waaaay past my bedtime.
     
  2. Lark

    Lark Well-Known Member

    I think the earlier law 1800's only required name of exporting country. I read in 1914 "made in" was required. I thought it was a later date like 1945.
     
  3. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Thanks Lark-seems like an easy question I've heard Dealers discuss it many times,but I guess there's more nuance to it,like all things political.
     
  4. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    This article/blog entry actually quotes the 1890 law, which is helpful, and notes that there have been a number of later amendments/additions:

    The 1891 McKinley Tariff/ Truth In Labeling Laws or, No, You Do Not Have A Real Stradivarius. By Diane Bruce
    http://masterhandviolin.com/Blog3.html

    "In 1890, William McKinley approved a tariff that, in addition to many other things, required this labeling [from section 6]:

    'That on and after the first day of March, eighteen hundred and ninety-one, all articles of foreign manufacture, such as are usually or ordinarily marked, stamped, branded or labelled, and all packages containing such or other imported articles, shall, respectively, be plainly marked, stamped, branded, or labeled in legible English words, so as to indicate the country of their origin; and unless so marked, stamped or branded, or labeled they shall not be admitted to entry.'
    This bill later became known as the Truth in Labeling Law. It was amended in 1914 so that all imports were required to say "Made in" in addition to including country of origin. It was further amended in 1921 so that all imports must include country of origin in English. Thus, Sachsen became Saxony and Nippon became Japan."
     
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  5. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    Since you mention Italy, I pulled this from Walter's book. As he is sadly no longer with us to give more details I'll put up what he said. He mentions that Italy seemed to ignore some of the requirements sometimes.

    From: Italian Pottery Marks From Cantagalli to Fornasetti by Walter and Karen Del Pellegrino.

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  6. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Awesome,thank you both ! I think,though before my time here-Walter & Karen were very respected contributors to our Forum (?).
    PS-Or people here knew them.
     
  7. evelyb30

    evelyb30 Well-Known Member

    Walter was for sure!
     
  8. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Sounds like a great guy & a legend in Italian Pottery-sorely missed I'd think.
     
  9. Ownedbybear

    Ownedbybear Well-Known Member

    On a practical note, makers only put Made In, if they wanted to export to the USA or a country which mandated it. Domestic wares and stuff for other countries was often unmarked.
     
  10. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the tip O'Bear-export for sure & too late I think to be 'Grand Tour'.
     
  11. evelyb30

    evelyb30 Well-Known Member

    And then only if made after 1890. The Japanese and others might only use a paper label, and said label would part was with the item as often as not.
     
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  12. Debora

    Debora Well-Known Member

    The design of the label should provide clues that can be useful for dating. A photograph of the item and the label would be helpful.

    Debra
     
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  13. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Here are Pics of the little guy I just shot (i exaggerated the detail on the 'made in Italy' stamp for clarity. 4 3/4" high by 5" long,solid bronze ( dull unlike brass).
    Lion1.jpg Lion2.jpg Lion3.jpg Lion4.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2023
  14. Ownedbybear

    Ownedbybear Well-Known Member

    He’s a souvenir of Venice, I have his twin, bought in the early eighties. I need to go check his undersides. I think yours is older because it’s stamped not labelled.
     
  15. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    He's a cutie-they still of course make them (Saint Mark). His face is a bit humanized,and even though he's prob 20's-80's,He's still got that slightly human face they put on critters in the Dark & Medieval ages cause they'd never seen an actual lion.Some older ones look like the 'Wiz of Oz' lion-weirdly very human.
    Egyptians had seen real Lions (Africa obviously) and a lot of theirs look real enough to bite.
    He's one of my fave ecclesiastical 'logos' so to speak.
    Of course the Catholic Church has always had some of the best & most inventive creative teams (design firms aka 'Madmen') in history.
    Pope Urban Tomb.jpg
     
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