Featured Imperial Kangxi seal

Discussion in 'Antique Discussion' started by hunt2, Jan 23, 2025.

  1. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    Hi everyone, i might have made my biggest discovery ever. I bought a seal as a gamble and after research it turnes out to be a genuine Imperial Kangxi seal. This type seal was only commisioned for the Kangxi emperor.

    The seal reads: Above and below the seal text are separate trigrams - not Chinese characters - called (bagua 八卦) - composed of three lines, each "broken" or "unbroken", representing yin and yang respectively. The trigram at the top is ☰ which means 乾 Heaven The trigram at the bottom is ☷ which means 坤 Earth Between the two is the inscription consisting of Chinese characters 體天主人 God Master When put together, the seal reads 乾坤體天主人 - God Master of Heaven and Earth. 1.jpg 4.jpg IMG_20250122_193018414.jpg
     
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  2. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Howdy Hunt-Any more info on your Seal-Bought where,material made of,online comps/research/auction data,historical info sourced from reputable institutions,etc,etc.
    All I can say is -it looks cool.
     
  3. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    [​IMG]

    I thought they were square....
     
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  4. Marote

    Marote Well-Known Member

    What research? Anything more than the question on asian arts forum?
    Mr Nagy replied: "The original of this seal belonged to Emperor Kangxi."
    That doesn't mean this is an original seal. Quite the opposite probably.

    If I understood the info correctly on this site: https://www.antiquekeeper.ca/?p=81777 , this one was sold at Sotheby's
    upload_2025-1-23_23-56-28.png
     
  5. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    see , square !!!
     
    Marote likes this.
  6. alynnfin

    alynnfin Well-Known Member

    It is very refined carving. Don't know anything about the rest but just love it.
     
    kyratango likes this.
  7. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

  8. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    My seal has the same machine marks as on a chinese bronze manchu seal from the qianlong period sold by christie's. And what's obvious is the patination from being in an incense burned filled room for a long time. as an 18th century incense burner see link below. But that is just my opinion.

    And i don't trust sotheby's because they have way to many seals for sale, proclaiming they are all imperial. That would be the same as that an auction house had a imperial ming vase every month / year. see link

    https://onlineonly.christies.com/s/art-asia/bronze-manchu-officials-seal-660/156161

    https://bloomsburypdx.com/products/antique-japanese-meiji-period-bronze-censer
     
  9. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    Yes that is the same as my seal finial, but chinese reproduced a lot of earlier style objects. But i will look into it further thanks. my seal is made of bronze.
     
  10. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Jan 24, 2025
    komokwa likes this.
  11. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    I said I wouldn't, but I just can't take so much misinformation. My only purpose is to set some things straight, not to take part in any discussion. So this will be my only post in this thread.

    As Mr Nagy clearly said, hunt's seal is after an original once owned by the Kangxi emperor.

    Just to be clear: Emperor Kangxi had seals in different palaces and retreats. He also had different seals for different occasions to chose from within every palace. So did the other emperors.
    Hunt's seal was never owned by Emperor Kangxi.

    The original Kangxi seal that was the inspiration for hunt's seal is shown in Marote's post. It came up for auction at Sotheby's Hongkong division in 2016. It is the seal Kangxi used in his calligraphy studio 'Yuanjianzhai', one of his retreats. Calligraphy is practised as an art in China, and it was one of Kangxi's favourite pastimes.
    The trigrams are part of the pursuit of harmony in one's surroundings and as a result within oneself. Perfect for a retreat where the emperor would like to relax and devote precious free time to a calming pastime.

    About the claim that the trigrams on the seal are the Bagua: Since there are only two trigram figures, the ones relevant to the specific situation in the retreat, they are not the Bagua. Bagua means eight trigrams (= eight trigram figures).

    Kangxi did not burn kilos of incense while practising the art of calligraphy. Just try burning so much incense that it fills the room with fatty smoke and then practise calligraphy in that smoke-filled room.

    Seals that belonged to, and were used by, the emperors were always clean, and never had "patination from being in an incense burned filled room for a long time". The imperial household just wasn't that careless, they paid attention that every item was kept in perfect condition in keeping with the status of the emperor.

    More on the original seal, the auction of the emperor's seals and the record of seals in the link below. Scroll down the page for the info on the Yuanjianzhai seal:
    https://enfilade18thc.com/2016/04/07/at-auction-the-kangxi-emperors-mandate-of-heaven-seal/

    About not trusting Sotheby's: That is of course a personal choice. But should one really make such a choice based on the number of imperial seals that are auctioned by Sotheby's?
    Fact is that the imperial seals that come up for auction at Sotheby's are nearly always seals that were used by imperial officials, so civil servants. China had a huge empire that was administrated to the smallest detail. There are countless imperial seals because there were countless imperial officials at any given time.
    Just to compare, at this moment a small country like the Netherlands has over 485,000 civil servants.

    Btw, there are Chinese round seals, I have two myself. Neither of mine were ever owned by emperor Kangxi, nor is hunt's.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2025
  12. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    thank you for claryfying that. Anyway you won't find a second one like mine.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2025
  13. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    My old man has pointed out that there are tool marks on the face of the stamp that indicate a router was used to finish the recesses around the animal figures. The circular router bit leaves marks of a consistent width, running parallel to the figures' design -

    upload_2025-1-24_10-30-38.png

    upload_2025-1-24_10-33-44.png

    The same phenomenon can be seen in this example of router marks on wood -

    upload_2025-1-24_10-41-6.png
    https://community.carbide3d.com/t/help-removing-path-marks/33750/13

    This is evidence of modern manufacture. In the case of the seal they may have been working with a pantograph, tracing a pattern. At any rate, the whole piece would have been cast in a mold, and I doubt that it is unique (one of a kind).
     
  14. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Excellent Detective work & commentary from both 2's Pa & AJ- as our illustrious detective would say-'Elementary My dear Watson !'-elementary once it's fully explained to me anyway !!!
     
  15. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    When was the first router used? And i have got a link of a bronze seal with the same carcteristics and same patina. And it dates to the 18th century??https://www.capitoliumart.com/en/lo...-qing-qianlong-period-18th-century/xlt-106843
     
  16. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

    well than show me another one like mine.
     
  17. hunt2

    hunt2 Well-Known Member

  18. bosko69

    bosko69 Well-Known Member

    Well sure enuf Hunt we got Us a predicament-but chances are,as they say down in the bayou-'That dog don't hunt'.
    But never say never...
     
    Marote likes this.
  19. Marote

    Marote Well-Known Member

    Why? Do you need to see another one before you are convinced that it's not the real deal? I recently bought a small statue, that was sold to me as being amber. The knowledgeable people here pointed out all the flaws, and that it clearly wasn't what I hoped for. Is there any identical statue out there? Most likely. Did I find any other identical statue? No. Did the peeps here show me any other identical statue? No. Does that mean that they we're all wrong, and that the statue could still be made of amber? NO

    If you're able to see similar lines as the ones @2manybooks mentioned, in the pics of the site you referred to, then your eyesight is magnificent.
    upload_2025-1-24_23-35-3.png

    That was actually a fun vid to watch for me, but I think most others here are well aware of how planes were/are used ...
     
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  20. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    @hunt2 - you are free to do your own research. We have pointed out what we see. No point in arguing with you.
     
    shamster, Any Jewelry and Marote like this.
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