Is this a real 1704 Gerard Valk Map of Southern Italy (Kingdom of Naples)?

Discussion in 'Antique Discussion' started by journeymagazine, Jun 30, 2020.

  1. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    I found this at a thrift store today. It appears to be a 1704 Gerard Volk map of Italy. I googled it and found one for sale at Geographicus; a rare map site online
    (https://www.geographicus.com/P/AntiqueMap/italiameridionalis-valk-1704) - the one for sale there measures 24.25" x 19.75" - mine measures (viewable area inside matting) 23.75" x 19.25" - exactly 1/2" less on each side; pretty close, right?
    Also it says it's from a atlas - mine has a crease/wear along it's center.
    It also says there are only 2 known examples, so it would be a long shot - but you never know!
    Is there any way to tell without taking it out of the frame?
    Any thoughts on it?
    Thank you!

    collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 1AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 2AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 3AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 4AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 5AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9AA.JPG

    TAKEN OUTSIDE IN SUNLIGHT

    collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 7AAzz.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 7AAAzz.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 7BAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 7CAA.JPG
     
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  2. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    looks real to me
     
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  3. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    Looks good and real to me too!
     
    Bronwen likes this.
  4. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    Without taking it out of the frame, please show us detail of the art and of some city labels that may no longer exist..?
     
  5. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    This is the only art I see - I will take close up of parts of the map

    collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 7AAAzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.JPG
     
    antidiem likes this.
  6. rink28

    rink28 Well-Known Member

    Unfortunately its torn on the edge
     
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  7. Miscstuff

    Miscstuff Sometimesgetsitright

    Looks printed and hand coloured to me. I don't think that printing method existed in 1704 so probably Victorian era copy.
    I'm having second thoughts. Those fine lines go in several directions so I'm probably wrong.:bag::bag:
    I'll shut up now.:angelic:
     
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  8. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    I guess I'll have to open back to be sure before I try to sell it as a original
    Thanks all!
     
  9. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    Here's some parts of map

    collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 8AA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 8AAA.JPG
     
  10. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    Think what they're saying is that there are only 2 known examples of the full original atlas:

    upload_2020-7-1_7-35-51.png

    'Separate issue examples are found in composite atlases as late as 1730.'

    Think the first thing to check is whether there really is a fold across the center or just the appearance of a fold. If it really is creased, then you might have something there.
     
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  11. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    Will do - carefully!
     
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  12. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    Brown paper backing is really brittle & crumbles when you try to tear it + it has a cardboard backing under it - I hope it has linen or some other backing !
     
    Bronwen likes this.
  13. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    If it's a reproduction, the place names will not have been updated. Interesting question of whether there were any later editions with changes. Herculaneum shouldn't be on it because it was not discovered until a few years after the map was published. It's one of the places, like Pompeii, that was buried in the eruption of Vesuvius.
     
    antidiem likes this.
  14. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    Well the crease in it is real & the measurements are almost the same - but someone mounted it to a board & it's in rough shape around some edges (but if it's 500 (or 400 if a later one?) years old that's to be expected, right?
    It said they were made between 1704 & 1730 - could this be a 1730 example?
    Thank you
    collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9BAAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9CAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9EAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9FAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9GAA.JPG collectible map italy 1704 GERALD VOLK 9HAA.JPG
     
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  15. Bronwen

    Bronwen Well-Known Member

    Certainly looks genuine. If the site you found has their facts straight, it's approx. 300 years old, even if it's a later printing. (Math wasn't your best subject, I'm guessing.) Seems as though people are always being referred to FB groups. Maybe there's a cartography one?
     
    samuelcaulfield1 likes this.
  16. journeymagazine

    journeymagazine Well-Known Member

    lol - I think I counted 2020 as an extra 200 years! Man that's embarrassing!
    I was thinking there may be a map forums site - I'll check both
    Thanks
     
  17. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    Put it back in the frame before you damage it.
     
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  18. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    :hilarious::hilarious:

    YES^^ agreed!!
     
  19. 2manybooks

    2manybooks Well-Known Member

    Is it handmade paper - showing laid and chain lines?
     
    PortableTreasures and aaroncab like this.
  20. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    From what I can see in the enlargements it does appear to show laid lines, albeit faintly.
     
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