My E.G. Webster (and sons) Lady?

Discussion in 'Metalware' started by flipper, Apr 18, 2020.

  1. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    lady.jpg lady2.jpg lady3.jpg lady4.jpg lady5.jpg My grandma gifted me this candelabra many years ago. Unfortunately, my bohemian lifestyle was not kind to it after several hundreds moves. I just pulled it out to ask about it because now I know more about it and I was wondering if any of you could help me pin down a date with the numbers provided 450/5 and a scratched on 51. It is quadruple plate by the metal dents easily and obviously breaks easily. What is it?
    Can I get it repaired? I have only found a pair of candlestick holders with the same woman, but there is not much detail provided on that listing...including the maker.
    Thank you

    Here is the other listing I found
    https://www.etsy.com/listing/685555...p_Hc-9i1MqYB6SeIUtKoH8vLu8fiYuLcaAoNDEALw_wcB
     
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  2. gregsglass

    gregsglass Well-Known Member

    Hi,
    Nice candelarium. If it says quadruple plate it is before 1912. That is when they stopped using the term.
    greg
     
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  3. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    Thank you! Quadruple plated what, please?
     
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  4. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    The plating is silver, but there is no way to be certain of what the base metal is.
     
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  5. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    With that greyish/silverish look on the broken piece, the base metal could be nickel silver. Often used to minimize the obviousness of wear to the plated surface.
     
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  6. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    Is it soft? Nickel silver? I thought they used hard white metals to make things strong? Is it spelter?
    What makes it a candelarium?
     
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  7. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    Spelter is a fancy word for "pot metal." Take all your leftovers and throw them in to melt down. Not an official alloy. There is no way to know whether you're going to get hard or soft - "brittle" is better term for spelter's often breakable quality.
     
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  8. Bakersgma

    Bakersgma Well-Known Member

    And no - nickel silver is not "soft" but that would have nothing to do with whether or not something could break. You can see from the picture that the base metal is not particularly thick and the position of the break is at a point where you don't need a lot of force to damage the piece,
     
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  9. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    Flipper, is it stamped just above her head on the left? What is that stamp, please?
     
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  10. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    I think it is plated pot metal (also sometimes called white metal?) and she's beautiful. Although difficult to discern in your picture, I love her art nouveau feet.
     
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  11. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    What kind of angle did you want to see to know how beautiful she is?

    That little mark is like a backwards C...but nothing else that I can see.

    So, Bakersma it could be a quality piece but I just broke it in a vulnerable spot?
     
  12. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    gg.jpg
     
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  13. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    I do think it's a quality piece, sorry you broke her. (Maybe Kyra would have repair suggestions?) I don't know how to repair pot metal but I know it can be done.
     
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  14. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    I really love her. If it's before 1912 that makes sense because my grandma said she got it when she was young and she was born in 1901.
     
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  15. antidiem

    antidiem Well-Known Member

    I love old art nouveau metal ladies. Here is where I thought it was writing on the top left. The top right could just be an indented cast area. Pardon it took me a while to make this show you! And for unknown reasons, it is too large when I post it, even though I decreased the size. Nothing's perfect anymore! ;)

    1.png

    Perhaps it is merely a small dent?

    She's lovely. :joyful:
     
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  16. Fid

    Fid Well-Known Member

    JMHO. a perfect repair would need a chemical analysis of the metal, then find a fitting solder etc.. too much time and costs for such an item of rather mediocre expression.
    I understand that you want to keep it as a souvenir; you could try to fix it with a general silver solder yourself: or simply with an instant adhesive if the parts still fit without too much clearance.
    there's fluid metal these days but I have no experience with that.
     
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  17. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    Thank you, Fid
    Yes, antidiem, I looked closely and all that was discernible was the backwards "c" and the other indents seem to be part of the design. At first I thought that "c" was within an arrowhead, where your second arrow is pointing, but there is really nothing there...I used a loupe?
     
  18. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    How do I polish this to not ruin it further! Please?
     
  19. Fid

    Fid Well-Known Member

    start with the least abrasive. polish cotton. and then different creams etc.
     
  20. flipper

    flipper Striving to face adversity with tact and humor

    Do you mean use a polish using something made from cotton?
    Thanks for the advice
     
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