Featured Please help dating necklace

Dear Antiquers members

Please help me to date and trace the origin of this necklace

It can be from any part of the world and any century. I only succeeded in identifying stones - amethyst quartz with hematite inclusions (from Brazil ?).

I will appreciate any help.

 

Hi @wanderer and WELCOME!!!! Can you go back in to your post by clicking on "Edit", then click on the very TOP image that says "INSERT EVERY IMAGE as a FULL image"!! Helps everyone to see your images much easier! Thanks so much!!

 

I don't think amethyst, I think Blue John.

 

Interesting piece.
Are you in the US? or did you find this in a different country.
I've not seen a clasp like that.



Welcome to the board.
Be sure to check back as we have people from all over and they come and go at all hours.

 

I am sorry I was not able to find “Edit” icon to change images on full size. I will follow your advised for future posts/replies.

I am in Australia and bought this necklace on auction. It can be part of deceased estate as well as just submitted for sale by individual. It was part of a lot. Australia is country of immigrants and everyone tried to bring most valuable heirlooms with them. Also, we like to travel a lot and tend to bring worlds curiosities back home.


On auction I saw items from Ming Dynasty China, India, Tibet, Mexica, Norway, Edwardian, Victorian and Art Nouveau items.


I browsed for hours on internet trying to find similar clasp. The only information I found that it is called “Byzantine hook clasp” and was popular from 300 BC and through Byzantine periods.


https://navettejewellery.org/2019/03/24/dating-necklaces-clasps-and-fasteners-part-i/


Although I think that it was used longer by amateur jewelers and jewelers in Indo Asia and may be in Pacific and South America.

This necklace is handmade. It is irregular in some parts but solid. No signs of soldering (may be just on links between plates. No stamps or inscriptions. Metal is most likely brass – it is yellow color at the back (protected by skin oil?) and dull in front (due to dirt and oxygenation?). There must be white metal (silver?) inserted under stones as it is shine under light.

Stones are similar to

https://www.gemgazer.com/amethyst-q...tite-inclusions-brazil-2563-carats-6735-p.asp

but more color.
Could someone suggest where else I can try to find information about this necklace please? ?

 

See the cone shape, that is what is unusual. Duplicated again in the second picture where the chain is connected to the stone piece.

 

May be a convict jeweler/pirate invention

 

What's unusual about the cone? They are used by many people and inexpensive.... https://furandhide.com/product/solid-copper-cones-1-1-4-inch/

 

Nice necklace, wanderer, and welcome.
I can't see all of the pics*, but what I see looks Indian. The plaited metal chain with cones on either side are seen a lot in India.
The stones could be amethyst, could be fluorite (English Blue John is also fluorite ), could be another purplish stone found in India. They are nothing like the Brazilian stone in the link imo.
The hook clasp is traditional in many parts of the world. It was also used in Byzantium, but that covers only a smidgen of hook clasp use. Given the size of India compared to Byzantium, India is a much better bet.


* My computer is extremely slow at the moment, and for some reason I can't access some photos (on Antiquers only).
It also takes forever to 'like' something, but believe me, I would love to 'like' a lot of your posts in the threads I have seen so far.
I would also love to ID some items that haven't been ID-ed yet, but with the current state of my computer that is virtually impossible. The same with seeing tags, so please forgive me if I miss some.

 

Yes, I agree the premise of the cone is used a lot.
It's the construction of this cone. The way the hook comes up from inside, as opposed to being attached to the cone.
The way the part where you attach the hook is pinched onto the other side.
I haven't seen one made that way.
It just looks different to me.

 

I agree, it is different from the cone in Holly's link.

 

There are probably many different techniques I have never seen and different materials used to make jewelry, it makes this board interesting. Have you ever seen blue or purple gold,magnetic platinum,24K crystallized gold?

 

Sorry to say I haven't and am not even sure I know what you are talking about.

 

Why would they need magnetic platinum?

 

To make earrings with floating disc among other things. https://stevenkretchmer.com/blogs/discover

 

Transparent aluminium, anyone?

 

Interesting site. Thanks.

 

Hi Everyone,


Thank you for your time, wisdom and expertise. I am inclining to agree with Any Jewelry – most likely this necklace is of Indian origin. Lately they had a lot of items from India on auction. If it would be from Byzantium it would cost hundreds of times more and most likely would be on display in a museum.


I will confirm with my Indian friend tomorrow (may be it is still antique/vintage )

Hematite inclusions (fine black hair like parallel structures) are very prominent in these stones. It must be common in fluorite and amethyst quartz worldwide.


The attachment design was probably dictated by material and practicality. It seems that the hook’s straight part is inserted inside the chain and almost twice longer then the cone. Chain is woven from more than 4 wires and must have cavity inside. Cone is tightly wrapped around to hold all parts together.


Thank you to Clatteredcloset-49 for all information/images on hooks and to Hollyblue for link to a very interesting jewellery site.


I will try to visit Antiquers as often as I can between my crazy shifts and help as much as I can.


Good hunting all

 

the plaited wire looks like viking knit.

 

It can be one of the oldest chain designs – imitating hair plaiting or material weaving.


Traditional Design Silver Rope Chain Necklace India

https://www.etsy.com/listing/487147386/traditional-design-silver-rope-chain?ref=similar_items-20