Featured Pre Columbian Artifacts Thread

I'm actually looking for someone who is knowledgeable about this stuff. Because I have no idea what a lot of the stuff I have is. Until then, here is a Mixtec Jade Eagle Knight Warrior from the Mitla Valley, ca. 1300-1500 ad. At least that is what the label says. I'll post some more tomorrow. Thanks

 

Well your peeps on TreasureNet seem to like them....but you need a hands on museum X-pert to drill down on these.

We could also use the same info here that you gave them.........
like the way they were stored in flimsy box...
the hand written name tags....
the fella you got them from....& where he came from.

I'm not saying they are not authentic......but I'm seeing red flags !!

 

Hello, Diggumup. (By the way, like your name!)

I'm not sure we have anyone on this board who is super knowledgeable on Pre-Columbian items. Also, it is super hard to positively ID this type of thing from a photo, but you can always post a few photos here and see what happens. Problem is, when things are possibly that old, to confirm one often needs xrays, samples of the material to be analyzed, etc.

 

Okay. I had already planned on that anyway. These were purchased at an estate sale. I wouldn't necessarily call it a flimsy box, but they were all in a wooden display case as shown below...



The man who owned them was born in Slovakia. There really was nothing else (pre-columbian) related in the house. One of the papers that has information written on it is an old pay stub of his from 1969, so I assume he has had some of these at least for near 50 years or so. The info pertains to the Penates (I believe) that were in the collection. Here is the stub, front and back photos...






Here is the man's obituary... https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/m...ry.aspx?n=paul-halas&pid=188744506&fhid=15136

Paul Halas, 86, of Cranbury, passed away peacefully at home on Thursday, April 12, 2018.


Here are some more pics of some of the items in the case...

 

more photos...














I'll post some more tomorrow maybe.

 

i like the frog.......just cuz i do !

 

Hi diggummup. I'd make an appointment at my nearest appropriate museum and with the box under my arm, I'd head there and get an expert opinion.

 

Yes, the best is to show it to a museum expert. or better two.
In my case, my "pre-Columbian" artefact was identified as original by a Mexican museum (I am in Mexico) but when we called archeologists to register it - which is a legal requirement in Mexico - they identified it as a mid-20th-century fake.

 

That is so sad, and inappropriate/unethical. I would not consider anyone an archeologist who also traffics in artifacts, real or otherwise. Can you let us know where you are located? I might be able to suggest a suitable museum or university in your area.

 

Lovely collection, Diggumup. I love the frog as well.
And from this too limited photographic distance most of them look genuine. But the too limited photographic distance is precisely the problem when dating archaeological items, especially stone and ceramic. You have to feel and smell as well as see them. And even then....
Pre-Columbian is an important market, which means there are many replicas and fakes. Replicas are sold as such, but later on in the buying and selling circuit they are often sold as authentic. Nowadays some replicas are marked on the bottom or back as such.
Simple souvenirs are easy to recognize, but with items which could possibly be genuine, our advice on the forum is always to take it to a museum with a specialized department.

 

As long as it is legal, I don't see why they couldn't sell their discoveries. Not all archaeologists have a lord Carnarvon to finance them.
Laws as to what can be sold freely, or with the appropriate permits or paperwork, differ from one country or region to another.
The problem arises when illegality enters the process, grave robbing, looting protected sites or digging at sites of special significance to others, or selling fakes as authentic pieces.

 

It is a matter of appearance - professional archaeologists should not be in a position to be suspected of stealing from their own sites or other collections that they have access to. It is the same for museum professionals - it just looks really bad for someone who has access to museum collections to be selling art and objects on the side. Which is not to say that it has never happened - hence the modern emphasis on codes of ethics.
The code of ethics for the Archaeological Institute of America states that members (professional archaeologists) should "refuse to participate in the trade in undocumented antiquities and refrain from activities that enhance the commercial value of such objects." They also state that "Professional archaeologists should not participate in projects whose primary goal is private gain."
If an artifact is recovered during a professional, well documented excavation, there is usually a designated repository (such as a museum) where it is supposed to be stored and cared for for future research.

 

You might try contacting the Archaeological and Historical Conservancy in Davie, Florida, which I believe would be near you. https://florida-archaeology.org/
I don't imagine they would be able to identify pre-columbian objects, but they might be familiar with archaeology departments in Florida that could help you. It might be a place to start.

 

These are very interesting.
I look forward to hearing about the information you will dig up.
I hope they are the genuine article for you.
Kevin.

 

I'll give them a try and see what they recommend. Thanks. It may be a bit though. Dealing with a family tragedy right now.

 

Sorry.....hope you work your way thru that.....

 

Very sorry to hear that, Diggum. The artifacts can wait, you have more important things to deal with now.

 

Wishing you all the very best.

 

Nice, items, but exist in america since ever to many fakes and artisans pieces sold to market in diferents places.
The warrior piece is very doubt, similiar to many pieces 1950 - 1960 o late.
With a microscope, you have to look at traces of modern tools.

cheers,
O.