Featured Royal Holland Delft Charger Boy Girl Eating Help ID or find another ____ Bisschop

Discussion in 'Pottery, Glass, and Porcelain' started by Mugzinnys, Oct 11, 2019.

  1. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    20191011_082745.jpg 20191011_082801.jpg 20191011_082820.jpg 20191011_082835.jpg 20191011_082852.jpg 20191011_082901.jpg One of my favorite vendors at the flea market let me have it for a very nice price. I have been researching all over but have not come across another with this scene.

    This is a very large Chop with a hairline that forks but it does not show too bad.

    AnyJeweler I would graciously appreciate Your input and knowledge in this area of the world.

    I researched that I might be able to seal the hairline with milk or stick a razor it the rim of the crack to allow the epoxy to seep in and seal it. I would not want to ship it s is and it arrives broken apart.


    The diameter of the wall plate is 16"
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2019
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  2. komokwa

    komokwa The Truth is out there...!

    stick a razor it the...........on no you don't want to try that.....:eek:
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  3. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    Use Krazy glue. Don't try opening the crack with anything - just align it the best you can then dot it along the crack. It will be drawn into the seam by capilliary action and will seal permanently.
  4. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    I can tell you a little. The signature on the front naar Bisschop means roughly, after Bisschop so would probably be a copy of a painting by Bisschop or like Bisschop.

    The plate itself has good info on the back. It's made by de Porceleyne Fles or Royal Delft. The BW is the date mark for 1952. According to Van Hook's book on delftware the number is an internal factory kiln number. Some pieces carry two artist's initials which I believe usually means that one painted the border and the other the scene. Your G.G. mark is for G. Gerlofsma who worked for the factory 1942-1984. The other initials I believe are for W.M.G. ten Hacken who worked for the factory 1939-1984.

    img20191011_193910.jpg img20191011_193831.jpg
  5. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    The Wallplate is 16" in diameter, Thanks komokwa for that I needed someone to say that definitely the
    last option.

    Is this transferware?
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  6. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    No it's all handpainted (see the above post).
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2019
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  7. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    Thanks, say_it_slowly crazy glue I like that idea. Thanks for the insight on the initials and the numbers on the back and all the other details. This plate is huge but I thought it was older. I am tingling from knowing that the plate was made a year before I was born
  8. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    Personally I'm not fan of crazy glue for good ceramics as my understanding is that over time it can cause a problem. But then I've been viewing through the "museum use" lens.
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  9. gregsglass

    gregsglass Well-Known Member

    My Gram always boiled the cracked piece in milk for two hours. If it was broken into pieces she had my great uncle staple the repair. Still have pieces repaired by Gram and Uncle Meile.
  10. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    I walked around for about 4 or 5 hours carrying it arounds so afraid of getting it damaged. There was another post which referred to glue being a negative in the long run. Blooney I went to the dollar store and got some crazy glue and I glued the rear and now I feel safer that I want damaged it around here in the small area that I work in. tomorrow I think I'll hang it up because I really don't want any harm to come to it in my care.
    Thanks everyone
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2019
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  11. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    @say_it_slowly ..Just wondering what's the downside to crazy glue for ceramic repair? Is it because it is permanent and hard to remove?
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  12. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    So there is something to that milk article that I read
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  13. Any Jewelry

    Any Jewelry Well-Known Member

    Beautifully painted plate, Mugz, all I can add to the excellent post by s-i-s (as always :)) is some info about the painter of the original painting.

    The scene is indeed after Bisschop. Christoffel Bisschop (1828-1904) was a painter from Friesland, in the north of the Netherlands. He was famous for rather sentimental paintings in a Frisian folk setting, though not exclusively that genre. The original would have been one of his folk setting paintings, but I haven't found it yet.
    In his day Bisschop was as famous as his Frisian contemporary, Lourens (Lawrence) Alma Tadema, and his wife was given jewellery by European royalty.
    Since then his work has gone out of fashion. Recently there has been renewed interest, but not on the scale of Alma Tadema's more internationally appealling paintings.

    This is a typical Bisschop painting, a mother mourning the loss of her baby. Every part of the interior and the dress is Frisian:
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
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  14. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    hmmmm....well it's been quite some time since I last researched glues and adhesives so I'll give you what I remember off the top of my head though newer information could be out there. I may not be remembering exactly correctly anyway. Generally speaking it was hard to find a "good" glue.

    Crazy glue and similar types as I recall can cause some ceramic bodies to degrade over time. The contact type of glues often used in museums paraloid/acryloid are reversible but I find them a bit difficult to make "look" good. The low yellowing two part epoxy Hxtyl nyl is expensive and hard to reverse. So what to use????? Before paraloid the old advice was a PVA (simple white glue) as it could be reversed with water if yellowed or weak however I think it's fallen out of favor and may not be as reversible as once thought. (Apparently Elmer's glue used to be a simple PVA but I've read they changed the formula awhile back so there were preferred other brands.) Anyway I don't repair much anymore but for my own I use a simple white PVA glue (not Elmer's) or Hxtal nyl though I have used paraloid/acryloid.
  15. Mugzinnys

    Mugzinnys Well-Known Member

    Thanks again s-i-s & aj
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  16. blooey

    blooey Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the explanation @say_it_slowly - I had no idea cyanoacrylates (super glues) had the ability to degrade some ceramics over time - if you can remember where you heard that I'd be eager to read the reports, never too old to learn!

    I know it has no gap filling abilities and I only use it on tight intimate breaks or hairlines, but if mixed with baking soda a reasonable fill can be achieved.
    I've even seen successful large ceramic repairs (a missing section of a broken sink or bathtub) done with it, using crushed instant noodles/superglue as a base filler! :D
    I have had some issues trying to undo bad PVA repairs, especially on wood, but I found the best solvent for dried white glue is vinegar - it does take some time to soften and remove, but it will come off after a good soak.
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  17. say_it_slowly

    say_it_slowly The worst prison is a closed heart

    I'll have to dig around to see what I can find. I've done a lot of reading for archaeology volunteering and have rather a lot of books and I've worked with some conservators so some things I've been told in person. I did have some links saved on my computer but the links are dead so I don't know what they said:( I'll see if I can remember.
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