Whereabouts of the originals of an Adolf Eberle and a Louis Toffoli

Hi All
Can anyone please help to identify the attached pics? One is a hunter and his family by a German painter called Adolf Eberle(1843-1914). The other one shows two mothers with their babies by a French painter by the name Louis Toffoli(1907-19990). The Toffoli picture I attached depicts a limited edition tapestry probably entitled 'yucatan'...Strangely I couldn't get any information about the whereabouts of the originals of these two paintings.I appreciate it if someone can shed a light.I got the two pics from google image.
Thanks in advance!
TTA

 

"Yucatan" title unlikely as the scene is Andean.

Debora

 

Apologies. That is indeed what the piece is called although it's not a Mexican scene.

http://www.art-richelieu.fr/html/fiche.jsp?id=2385763&np=17&lng=fr&npp=20&ordre=&aff=2&r=

Are you sure there's an "original" painting of the tapestry? The web site above states the tapestry was based on a carton.

Debora

 

I'd look here first:

http://www.artaujourdhui.info/m1395-musee-toffoli.html

Debora

 

And then here:

http://galerieperahia.com/fr/expositions/toffoli

They say on their web site that they've 200 pieces of his work on permanent display.

Debora

 

Improbable as it may be the title does appear to be "Yucatan" or "La Mere au Yucatan." I think it may have sold at auction in 2008....but there is no photo or price for that sale and that may not be the same painting/tapestry.

My French is not good though:
http://www.art-richelieu.fr/html/fiche.jsp?id=2385763&np=17&lng=fr&npp=20&ordre=&aff=2&r=

and
http://www.artprice.com/artist/28518/louis-toffoli/painting/5609450/la-mere-au-yucatan

 

The first one is entitled "The Old Hunter at Home."

Debora

 

You first link is to the sale of a tapisserie or tapestry. The second link might be it, for a painting on canvas.

Debora

 

This is the painting that comes up with that title:

http://www.pba-auctions.com/html/fiche.jsp?id=371019&np=3&lng=fr&npp=20&ordre=&aff=5&r=

Debora

 

Thanks Deborah and all-fakes!
Regarding the Toffoli,,,the one auctioned under yucatan is a tapestry,,the other one sold with Yucatán title is a diffetent painting...Deborah has noted whether an original exists as it says in the tapestry auction( translated as)
"Tapestry prints after a carton of the artist",,,but as we all know limited prints of pictures are released after real originals,,hence the existence of a carton in the design of the tapestry only adds one layer to the mystery..but good point all the same,,,I couldn't find the website of the toffoli museum maybe I will ask them by email,,the other gallery website shows some lithographs and paintings of Toffoli but our illusive picture is not there,,,hence the mystery continues,,,
Regarding the Adolf Ebeler pic, yes the title is as what Deborah forwarded,,but there is no information whatsoever anywhere,,,isn't it strange?
Let's see what others could add ,,,
Again thanks for the great feedback!
TTA

 

Preparatory drawings for things including tapestries were called cartoons.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=cartoon

cartoon (n.)
1670s, "a drawing on strong paper (used as a model for another work)," from French carton, from Italian cartone "strong, heavy paper, pasteboard," thus "preliminary sketches made by artists on such paper" (see carton). Extension to comical drawings in newspapers and magazines is 1843: "Punch has the benevolence to announce, that in an early number of his ensuing Volume he will astonish the Parliamentary Committee by the publication of several exquisite designs, to be called Punch's Cartoons!" ["Punch," June 24, 1843]

See the Raphael cartoons in the V&A:
http://www.vam.ac.uk/page/r/raphael-cartoons/

 

But they can be finished paintings. See the Goya cartoons in The Prado:

https://www.museodelprado.es/en/wha...n-madrid/297f52f2-36c7-4580-b03a-8ff66da64f8d

Word in Spanish same as in French carton.

Debora

 

Don't think it's strange that ownership not showing up on internet. Could be anywhere -- a regional museum, a private collection.

Would it be cheeky of me to ask why you're trying to locate them?

Debora

 

The thing is, the whole philosophy of limited prints with artist signature was to give buyers the chance of owning something authentic even though they missed the one and only original painting the artist sold.. Artists
nowdays keep a digital backup when they sell thier originals so that they produce thier prints easily..in older days there were other means,,the preparatory cartoon work in this tapestry just shows how the printing was made and does not rule out an original existed,,,
TTA