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<p>[QUOTE="Any Jewelry, post: 2443158, member: 2844"]Yep. Couldn't find the word, when I am tired there are too many languages competing for prime position inside my head.</p><p><br /></p><p>You've got to admit, not really a bar, is it.<img src="styles/default/xenforo/smilies/wink.png" class="mceSmilie" alt=";)" unselectable="on" /></p><p>I am sorry, I have been doing my best to see it your way, but I know too much about French provincial life through family etc to believe a French provincial carver had no clue what a French fleur-de-lys looked like. He would only have had to visit the local mairie once, for his marriage or to declare the birth of his child etc, to have seen a fleur-de-lys. Besides, even provincial carvers worked with pattern books. They may not have lived in cosmopolitan cities, but they weren't ignorant.</p><p><br /></p><p>Another thing is that these are found in all Roman Catholic regions in the world. With symbols like the Madonna lily, an angel's head, other imagery, or with no decoration at all. They were cast in metal or carved from wood.</p><p>Are you trying to say that French provincial carvers made and exported them all over the world, putting local craftspeople out of a job? Surely in all these countries and regions it would have made far more sense, and be much cheaper, to commission them from local craftspeople or workshops?</p><p>I have personally seen them around the world, and also saw them in Hungary when I visited churches etc as a theology student. One of my special interests during my study was religious semiotics through symbolism.</p><p><br /></p><p>Just an example: Base of a brass Dinanderie church candlestick, with a stylised lily. The three petals/leaves symbolise the Holy Trinity. Not unlike the Hungarian candlestick, but you've got to admit, no resemblance with a French fleur-de-lys.<img src="styles/default/xenforo/smilies/wink.png" class="mceSmilie" alt=";)" unselectable="on" /></p><p>As you can see, the casting of this Dinanderie ware, and the crown between the base and the body of the candlestick, are just as crude as the carving on the Hungarian candlestick.</p><p><br /></p><p>[ATTACH=full]264791[/ATTACH][/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="Any Jewelry, post: 2443158, member: 2844"]Yep. Couldn't find the word, when I am tired there are too many languages competing for prime position inside my head. You've got to admit, not really a bar, is it.;) I am sorry, I have been doing my best to see it your way, but I know too much about French provincial life through family etc to believe a French provincial carver had no clue what a French fleur-de-lys looked like. He would only have had to visit the local mairie once, for his marriage or to declare the birth of his child etc, to have seen a fleur-de-lys. Besides, even provincial carvers worked with pattern books. They may not have lived in cosmopolitan cities, but they weren't ignorant. Another thing is that these are found in all Roman Catholic regions in the world. With symbols like the Madonna lily, an angel's head, other imagery, or with no decoration at all. They were cast in metal or carved from wood. Are you trying to say that French provincial carvers made and exported them all over the world, putting local craftspeople out of a job? Surely in all these countries and regions it would have made far more sense, and be much cheaper, to commission them from local craftspeople or workshops? I have personally seen them around the world, and also saw them in Hungary when I visited churches etc as a theology student. One of my special interests during my study was religious semiotics through symbolism. Just an example: Base of a brass Dinanderie church candlestick, with a stylised lily. The three petals/leaves symbolise the Holy Trinity. Not unlike the Hungarian candlestick, but you've got to admit, no resemblance with a French fleur-de-lys.;) As you can see, the casting of this Dinanderie ware, and the crown between the base and the body of the candlestick, are just as crude as the carving on the Hungarian candlestick. [ATTACH=full]264791[/ATTACH][/QUOTE]
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