Holy Mary with child (wood)

Helly everyone,

Has anybody got an idea which country or region this style origins from? I've never seen this kind of decoration before, it looks kind of eastern European in my opinion. Anything would be helpfull!

 

Hard to tell from your photographs but appears to be a black Madonna and Child. Perhaps a reproduction. Here is a list of the famous ones.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Madonna

Debora

 

r u sure that's wood ?

 

More likely to be resin.

She's Our Dear Lady of Altotting Bavaria, Germany.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrine_of_Our_Lady_of_Altotting

 

Altötting is one of the main Gypsy pilgrimage sites in Europe.
The most famous one is Les-Saintes-Maries-de-la-Mer in southern France, where I spent many a pilgrimage with Gypsies. Very fond memories. Sadly most of the old people have gone now, and the young crowd is very different.

 

I've been to a few - mostly the Spanish ones.

 

El Rocío?

 

Yup! Not for years though.

And I know the Montserrat Madonna very well, although she's a different thing again.

 

Very beautiful though, and a stunning location.

 

She's my favourite. I love Montserrat with a passion.

 

i liked the concert.....

 

I can imagine, I have the same with Les-Saintes-Maries-de-la-Mer, although I hear it is a very different place now from when I used to go there.
The Gypsies there worship Sainte Sarah or Sarah Kali, and she will always stay the same. Kali means black in Romany, so she is a bit like a black Madonna.
She may not be the prettiest of statues, but it is a very emotive place, especially when the Gypsy clans come with new robes for her:


A friend of mine still goes there and always lights a candle for me, the sweetheart.

 

Ah, my language bump kicks in. I love the fact that Romany has bits of Hindi.

 

It is in fact a bit older than Hindi, closely related to Sanskrit. But they did pick up a lot of words on the way to Europe, notably Armenian and Persian.
We live in one of the Dutch Gypsy areas, if you can call it that with such a small population, and Romany here has a lot of German words as well.

 

I would love to hear more about you and your memories, I find what you write very interesting. I also love to read about Mansons life and memories.

 

I wish Mansons did............................

And I agree - I think Any's life sounds so much more interesting than mine...........or should I say that ANY life sounds so much more interesting than mine!!!!!!!!!!

 

Not true, I find it fascinating. We will not know for sure until Any tells us more as to which is the more interesting. Besides you have a gift of story telling and writing.

 

I think neither Mansons nor I are up to a writing duel, but I am sure we both led full lives when we had the chance. This makes me sound past it, I'm not, but I don't expect any interesting experiences to come my way soon. By the way, Mansons is the better writer.

About the Gypsies, they are still the most misunderstood nation in the world, and the word Gypsy is often used very loosely (i.e. Irish Gypsies). They have been derided, mistreated and murdered, and still are, because of their ethnicity, yet they are just about the only nation that has never started a war.
An estimated 1.5 million were murdered by the Nazi's, something that is often forgotten. To add insult to injury, photographs of Sinti, Manouche and Roma Gypsies are often used to illustrate Jewish suffering during WWII. Not that Gypsies don't want to be compared to Jews, but their identity is stolen from them. What is worse, is that their departed are portrayed. For many traditional Gypsies, showing photographs of the dead means their souls will have no rest. An example, which the relatives are very hurt about, is a well-known photograph of a Dutch Gypsy girl with a white headscarf on a train. I know her name and I used to know members of her family, and I can only ask everyone, please don't ever use that photograph.
My experiences with Sinti and Manouche Gypsies have always been good. It is the same as encounters with any other people in this big world, as long as you're respectful, view and treat them as fellow human beings, but be mindful of the fact that they have a different culture with different sensitivities, things usually go smoothly. And when you're invited, dress smartly, it shows respect. I have seen people trying to 'go Gypsy' in their dress and never get asked back. Different sensitivities often means very differently with traditional Gypsies. They have very strict laws on cleanliness, purity and impurity, which they clearly brought with them from India.
I have always found them to be very hospitable, generous, and protective. And they have a wicked sense of humour.

I was once invited to the wedding in southern France of a Gypsy girl I was very fond of. I happened to be the first to give her a present, just chance, or not.... Her mother said it meant that I would be married within a year. I told her in that case I would have to meet someone else soon, because my boyfriend had two failed marriages behind him and no intention of ever marrying again.
I was away from home for a week, my boyfriend hadn't been able to go with me. When I got back he proposed to me, he said he had missed me too much. We had local Gypsy musicians playing at our wedding, and have been married for 26 years now.

 

My compliments on an excellent post. The Irish Travellers here call themselves just that: travellers. They are devoutly Catholic and very socially conservative indeed. They adore bling. And Crown Derby!

 

Thanks Obb, the fate of Gypsies and the way they are viewed is something I am very passionate about, as you probably noticed. They very rarely speak out for themselves.

Irish travellers have a very interesting origin, it is said they are descended from travelling bards and druids who lost the publics esteem when Ireland became a Christian country. Their language, Shelta or Cant, contains some remnants of the sacred druid language.
Irish 'Gypsies' in the US have started to use Romany words instead of Shelta, this leads to even more confusion on the ethnic identity matter.