How old is this large tapestry?

Hi! I'm new to this board and was hoping I could get some insight into an old tapestry I recently found. It measures about 5' x 6' I think? It's very unusual - I can roll it up (it's not stiff), but it's definitely hefty with a lot of uneven areas. The pics of the front that are more vibrant were taken in artificial light. Also, there is a zipper casing at the top and bottom, hand-stitched to the back - maybe for a dowel to slip through? It seems like a later addition, but I can't be sure.

Does anyone have an idea of how old it might be?

Thank you!
BB

1 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:31 PM

2 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:31 PM

3 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

4 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

5 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

6 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

7 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

8 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

9 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 3:30 PM

 

Hi and WELCOME to ANTIQUERS, @bellebelle!! I can't, but others should be along who should be able to help you more! Much of the carpet or hanging looks so faded, it's hard to discern what the subject matter is, sadly. At least for me, anyway!!

 

Thank you so much! It's definitely tough to make it out, but it looks like a woman in early to mid 1700's dress being courted by two suitors in front of a fountain in a woodland setting. There appears to be another woman behind the man on the right and a musician playing an instrument in the bottom left corner.

 

Looking at texture only, it is so perfectly regular I’m thinking it was made by a machine. Anyone know bout dat?

 

It's a Baroque courting scene. Most of these were machine-made in Belgium in the first half of the 20th century. I would assume rings across top mean it was designed as a wall hanging. Condition (obviously) rough. Here's something similar more or less.

https://www.ebay.com/i/183928390551...MI9fDz3_nC5QIVWiCtBh1IgA2WEAQYAyABEgKHo_D_BwE

Debora

 

Hi! Thank you for the pic. The rings were added much later (in the 80's it seems) when the whole thing was attached to a 2x4 curtain mount with a metal pulley. It had an attached piece of masking tape on it that the tapestry was to be used as a Roman curtain.

I'd be curious to see what the back of the one you linked to looks like - so many of the ones that look like that are flat on the backside it seems, with no loose fibers.

 

I think I found one from the 1920's (Belgian) that looks similar in texture to the one I have.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-HA...=202482406773fb316a863ec94f8c864eacd82331e04b

 

Typically, the older something is the more finely made it is. Here's a genuine 18th century tapestry. Subject matter quite different but it achieves a dimensionality of imagery and nuance of color that a modern tapestry can't equal.

Debora

 

Yes, the older ones look almost like paintings - pretty incredible! That's what tripped me up about the one I have. It's rather crude, but it also doesn't feel mass produced. Do you know if the ones being made in 20th century were still being hand-loomed at all? (And thank you so much for the info!!!)

 

A true hand-loomed tapestry is going to have the same image front to back, as seen here in this example from The Met. More information here.

https://www.metmuseum.org/blogs/now-at-the-met/2014/making-a-tapestry

Debora

 

Ah! Interesting. Those long fibers on the back of mine indicate a machine, then, I suppose.

 

Tapestries are still hand-loomed. But, as it takes 6-12 months to produce a square meter by hand, catering to decorative tastes in the 1920s and 1930s with hand loomed tapestries would not have been cost effective.

The Royal Tapestry Factory in Madrid, Spain has been in operation since the 18th century. These are modern Picasso tapestries that were owned by the Rockefeller family and which were produced there in the 20th century.

http://realfabricadetapices.com/en/

 

Wow, those are amazing!

P.S. this morning I dug out some tapestry fragments I have, and I see now what you're talking about up close. This one is the same on the front and back with none of the long fibers. This piece is about 14" x 18" I think?

fragment 1 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 9:09 PM

fragment 2 by bellebelle posted Oct 29, 2019 at 9:09 PM

 

Whoa, I'm watching the video on the Royal Tapestry Factory - the process is bonkers! Thank you for the link, Debora.

 

Morning! I requested additional pics from the eBay tapestries posted - both the machine-woven one Debora posted and the 1920's one I tracked down. The first one had a flat back, Jacquard-woven. The 1920's one had a back very similar to mine, and the antiques dealer selling it said it was hand-loomed. A friend of mine reached out (I didn't realize she knew about tapestries!!!) and mentioned that the long fibers I was wondering about are called floats. She also felt that mine was hand-loomed or at least that the loom was on the less mechanical end. ? Either way, I definitely smitten by the history of tapestries now!

 

I've always thought the mid-century tapestries by Portuguese artist Jose Almada Negreiros in the lounge of Lisbon's Ritz Hotel (now the Four Seasons) stunning.

 

Wow!!! Absolutely beautiful!